@JonWest56 wrote on Twitter: “Tried to relive my childhood by seeing Incredibles 2 yesterday. The movie would have been fine if there wasn’t an agenda. Very modern feminist movie. Leave politics out of cartoons and children’s movies. Bad enough it’s all you hear now, but kids movies?!? COME ON”
Two things infuriated me after reading this twitter comment in The Guardian article. 1) This flawed assumption that because Disney ( and any form of entertainment for that matter) is meant to be amusing, it should be exempt from any discussion regarding politics. And 2) that we should “protect” our children from being exposed to the political conversation of feminism. Well it may come to the disappointment of @JonWest56 when I say that this is almost impossible to do.
As naturally political creatures, humans have always created and shared stories that reflect our values, desires, dreams, as well as our prejudices and hatred. In fact, when we reflect upon the early years of Disney Animation, we can see that the conversation of feminism did not start with our modern-day heroines (Elsa, Moana, Mrs. Incredible, etc.). On the contrary, “the one that started it all” was Walt Disney himself in his depictions of women prior to the second wave of feminism.
Pre-Feminist Disney Characters
During Walt Disney’s time, it was widely accepted among the white middle and upper class that women should follow four cardinal virtues: piety, purity, domesticity, and submissiveness (aka cult of true womanhood). We see these exact virtues embodied in the early Disney princesses Snow White, Cinderella, and Aurora. Limited in the plots of their own stories, all three women are portrayed as domestic housewives, who let others define their fate, and are considered to be “the purest” and at one with nature (with the ability to talk to animals). And as a reward for exhibiting these virtues they are considered beautiful, saved by the “handsome prince,” and get to live happily ever after.Disney not only offered us three princesses who fit in the ideology of true womanhood—but he also offered us three female villains who do not.
According to Professor Landon Storrs, a women and feminist movement history professor at the University of Iowa, these female characters should be considered as the early anti-feminist characters:
“When people think about the word ‘feminism’, some weird stereotypes always occur against it,” Storrs said. “This sort of stereotypes but not limited by identifying them ‘trying to be man’, “hyper-masculinity”, ‘less sexually attractive’, ‘crazy and lack of motherhood’ and ‘so smart that can trick men’.”
Conforming to these stereotypes, the Evil Queen, Cinderella’s stepmother, and Maleficent were not only powerful and independent but they were also punished as a result of embodying what feminist activists recommended women should be. Whether it was intentional or not, Walt Disney sent a message to his viewers the type of woman society should accept.
the progression of society: Our understanding of “feminism”
As our society evolved and progressed, so did our media and the female characters that were presented in Disney films. With characters like Belle, Nani, Mulan (and countless others), Disney began to incorporate strong, independent women who could hold their own against their male counterparts and the gender norms within our society. Yet for some reason we get comments like @JonWest56, that are against discussing feminism. But, why? I believe its because, for the most part, men and women do not truly understand what being a feminist means. More often than not, some make the false equivalency that to be a feminist is to hate men: and at one point of time I believed the same thing. However, Chimamanda Ngozi Adichie defines feminist as “a person who believes in the social and economic equality of the sexists.” That means, that in defying the socially constructed gender roles for women, feminists should also strive to do the same for men. In my opinion, Incredibles 2 is the first of its kind to explore and challenge the gender norms for both women and men.
helen & Bob parr: the reversal of gender roles
Incredibles 2 was, undoubtedly, a big hit in the box office. And while some may credit that to the 10 year wait, the action sequences, or the quality of the animation, I personally enjoyed the film because of its challenge against gender norms within the family dynamic. A direct contrast to the original film Helen and Bob Parr switch roles. And as we get to see Mrs. Incredible be a complete badass, Bob becomes the stay at home parent: which is no easy task. Not only is it rare for us to see an animated character dealing with the hardships of being a parent, but it is especially rare for us to see a male character internally struggle with being a dad. Bob’s dilemma with not being a superhero seems to be an analogy to men’s dilemma in dealing with American’s definition of masculinity. Explored in the documentary, The Mask You Live In, American masculinity tells young boys that in order to be a man (or in Bob’s case a superhero) you have to “toughen up,” “don’t cry,” and “to always (above anything) be a man.”
In the first Incredibles film, we see Bob live up to the socially constructed idea of what it means to be a man: the idea that men/fathers are supposed to be the strong leaders of the family, with their sense of value stemming from having a successful career and being the breadwinner of the family. However when Bob’s role as a superhero breadwinner shifted onto Helen in the second film, Bob is not only conflicted with the reality shift but he questions his ability 
to be a father. It is only when Bob detaches himself from the harmful ideas of American masculinity that he is able to overcome these obstacles by outwardly expressing his emotions, sharing, and resolving his fears with close friends and family. Bob’s character is given the freedom to be as vocal and as expressive with his emotions as his teenage daughter, Violet: and as a result they are able to help each other.
What makes the Incredibles franchise so “incredible” is not just relied upon the idea of a family of superheroes: but because they are so relatable. Within this family dynamic, each character deals with their own obstacles that is relatable in our own homes. And while Elasti-Girl shows girls/ women that they can be as passionate and influential in their chosen career, Bob teaches boys/men that they can be just as emotional and expressive with their feelings in the way that women are.
No movement is perfect and mainstream feminism could do a lot more to represent both genders, people of color, etc. Incredibles 2, in my opinion is the primary example of a feminist film that doesn’t diminish the value of neither the female nor the male characters. Moving forward, feminist should not only demand for and understand the importance of characters like Elasti-Girl. But they should do the same for characters like Mr.Incredible.
Sources Used:
https://www.theguardian.com/film/2018/jun/28/incredibles-2-feminism-animation
Feminist Movement in the U.S. and Changes of Disney Characters
http://www.storytellingday.net/history-of-storytelling-how-did-storytelling.html
I feel like usually the fact that men are also meant to benefit from feminism is overlooked, so I’m so glad you brought up this aspect of feminism. Bob’s character is such a great representation of this, but I’m pretty sure you’re the first person I’ve heard bring this up. You made so many good points and it really made me realize what a good message Incredibles 2 has.
I really liked that tweet that you began your blog post with (I had never seen it before). I never realized that through trying to challenge and start a conversation about gender norms, the movie would be criticized for “exposing” children to different ideas about gender roles. Although I know people have differing views on feminism, I did not really think this would be a topic of concern when it came to movies targeted at a younger audience. Personally, I think children’s entertainment is a really good platform to explore a changing modern society.
Bringing up Bob and Helen’s arc is a great comparison to how early Disney women were represented. It’s nice to see how messages related to gender have changed over time and that today’s kids can have a broader, more contemporary sensibility to what it means to be a boy or girl. The obsession with purity and submissiveness in these old princesses doesn’t exactly send the right message to young girls who want to break that mold. Kids now can see Helen be a go-getter and Bob cope with his new life. @JonWest56 underestimates children’s perceptions and how much they can handle.
It’s interesting that person tweeted to leave politics out of it, but something I heard from Guillermo del Toro that everything that you put in your film is political deciding whether or not to portray diverse cast or women in a certain way; everything is political no matter what in some way or another and as you said humans are just naturally political creatures. I do hope that toxic-masculinity gets fixed soon and hopefully with films for younger audiences like Incredibles 2; it shows that it’s okay to show emotions or other traits that aren’t consider what people consider “masculine”. I hope that we can break the barrier between what is consider feminine and what’s masculine.
I like that you brought up qualities of Disney villains such as Maleficent, the Evil Queen, and Cinderella’s stepmother that are feminist in nature but convoluted as bad because the motivation is one that seeks to harm the protagonist. In a lot of way it’s these qualities of ambition, confidence, strategic planning, resourcefulness, and proactivity that make these characters more interesting to watch. There’s a purpose that drives these characters in a way that Sleeping Beauty, Snow White, and Cinderella never had. Villains are bad because society or those in power decide they are bad. In a similar way, those who condemn feminism and its influences on media say its bad because the motivation appears to be bad. Equality for all genders, (and further equality regardless of identity) can seem like a bad idea to those like @JonWest56 because suddenly someone else is in the spotlight.
I found it super interesting that in earlier Disney movies, the villains are more similar to feminism than the main characters. Looking back at the films and what you had to say made a lot of sense and it’s crazy to see how wide of a difference there are between the villains and main characters. I really enjoyed how you included The Incredible’s 2 because growing up, both of my parents worked but eventually my dad retired first and became a stay-at-home dad. I never saw him less as a man than what was idealized to be masculine for the stereotypical gender roles. There are definitely going to be more feminist movies coming out in the future and it’s going to be interesting to see how the future movies will present themselves in a larger story.
Something that we’ve discussed in class before and that I’ve always had an issue with is that while we have seen some strong female characters in films before, its very rare that we see sensitive/emotional male characters. I really liked what you said about Incredibles 2 showing both a strong female lead and a somewhat emotional male lead. I’ve seen the film multiples times now, but the thought never crossed my mind that it’s a truly feminist film by switching gender roles. It really makes me happy that an big-name animated film included that, and I hope that this continues in the future.
One of the reasons that I love both the Incredibles movies, is that they gave my parents two, well-developed characters to relate to. I remember when Hotel Transylvania came out, my dad was so excited to have an animated father that didn’t exist solely to tell their young, protagonist child that they can’t achieve their dreams, as most parents do in animated films. Incredibles 2 got the same reaction from both my parents, but ten times stronger. My mother loved having Helen’s hero adventures be one of the focuses of the film (her favourite part from the original is when Helen infiltrates the evil island base) and my dad found all the Bob-interacting-with-his-kids scenes to be incredibly relatable and a welcome change from how men are usually portrayed. I think there’s a lot of value in showing an older adult male character be emotional, and tackle obstacles not centered around being the breadwinner, for the male gen x-ers and baby boomers to relate to.
When watching Incredibles 2 I didn’t think it lived up to the last movie. It was a great film by every means but I still preferred the first one better. After reading your blog post I have a different feeling about the movie because I completely agree with how the movie used bob and Helen to show how boys don’t have to conform to toxic masculinity and how women and be passionate and do well in any career they choose. I really never thought about the subtlety of these messages and I really appreciate it in this film.
I think your point about women in positions of power being depicted i terms of having powerful women who then need to be narratively reprimanded (oftentimes by men) for having that power. This, I think, relates to the age-old phenomenon of the duality of the portrayal of women as being powerful but needing to be controlled or restrained. Whether it is in religious texts depicting women with such a caveat (goddesses needing to be controlled by gods), or in comic books with characters like Jean Grey with an incredible amount of power, but who can’t control it and subsequently needs to be controlled by others (usually men). This tactic has been used through literature and media for generations as ways to check women’s power, and I feel like your point really rang true to that practice or limiting women.
I was pretty jaded about Incredibles 2 before reading this. I remember sitting in the theater with my mom, laughing at how few female names we saw in the credits. However, your points reminded me of the positive message that the film did offer, so thank you for that! I think people got super worked up because every once in a while, the screenwriting was a tiiiiiny bit sloppy in Incredibles 2, stating things that I think could’ve stayed more subtle. I’m just waiting for more movies like it to be made so that this doesn’t need to be a deviation when discussing gender norms in films!